project 52

Just speaking from my personal experience:  even after you buy a playboat, don't forget to get the Mamba out from time to time and keep building on the skills base you have developed.  I bought a playboat around the point in my learning curve that you are at and only used playboat almost exclusively for the next year or two.  My river running skills suffered as a result.  That being said, I am not much of a playboater in spite of using one for a while.  I now have the runner (Burn) that I use most of the time and then a playboat when I am looking to shake it up a bit.  If I had to do it over again, I'd probably have stuck with a runner for the first year or two, kept progressing up the river classification, then tried play boating once I felt I could run III+ comfortably in my runner.  Or carved out more spare time and added playboating to the agenda.  But then I was only looking at 20+ days a year on the river, so I had to make some choices - running or playboating.

Mokelumnekid:

Honestly, it comes down to what fits and feels best to you, and how much you're willing to spend; everyone has different body types and paddling styles. There are a TON of playboats out there and there's a boat that will be perfect for you.

I would recommend going to a pool session ('tis the season!) and asking people with playboats to try it out in the pool. Granted, a boat in the pool isn't quite like a boat on the river, however, you can get a feel for the way it fits you, where it's edges are, and how you paddle in it. When you find one that you're comfortable in and enjoy being in, demo it from either a local kayak shop, or if you have a good relationship with the person at the pool session they may let you try it out (probably with them present on the river with you, of course).

Some people just buy a playboat and live with it. This is another approach, but I've heard from enough of my friends that they wish they'd looked hadn't because they found one later that was "so much better" than the one they had blindly purchased.

My playboat is a Jackson Fun. What I like: it's relatively forgiving for a playboat, it can be outfitted to anyone easily, it handles well for my paddling style, and I'm comfortable in it. What I don't like: the rope system for the back brace; it wears out over time and can be annoying to deal with before you get it fixed. I've heard from some people that they've never had this problem with the Jackson rope system; you may not either. Remember though, this is a boat that I like and I own... you may or may not like it yourself.

And with any boat (personal experience on this): habitually check your bolts! They can come loose over time and come undone at the most inopportune moments and cause problems.

Hope that helps!

Thanks everyone (and those that PM’d me). Awesome and diverse input! Here’s the back-story. I recently ran into a guy I took my first roll class with. He told me he had done Boulder Drop running at 5 gazillion cfs, etc. etc. and other solid runs about the time I was crawling down Big Eddy like a scardy-cat. The difference was that he aggressively got into doing pool sessions with a play boat. He had to learn how to roll, brace, and swash-buckle from the get-go. He may flip as much as me in big water, but sounds like he shrugs it off better, and has internalized a sense of confidence that I lack. Hell folks- I still can’t brace (grrrrrr….and I’m trying…’nuther story)

Reminds me of my climbing days as a trad guy (yeah I’m that old). When sport and bouldering came along everyone’s skill level shot through the roof. So I ask myself if having a play boat in addition to my Mamba will encourage me to develop an enhanced sense of balance and tempo, and allow me to progress more quickly by working two fronts. Just like bouldering or going to the climbing gym does to climbing.Or I'll suck at both of 'em

I’m really not interested in play boating for its own sake (but good on ya folks who do!) I am really interested in down-river experiences at this point (that trad thing again?). Plus I swear there are days on the Sky when I’m the only guy out there in an eight foot, 46 pound boat! How uncool. Just saying!

Thanks again everyone and keep it coming,

Dude- i'll spare everyone the longwinded posts that are my signature on this site-

Get a playboat. No reason to confine or restrict yourself if U got da $.

BUT don't draw the carriage before the horse, bro. RIVER RUNNING or creekin or whatever you wanna call it is the STAPLE of this sport. I'd put it slightly ahead of your playboating agenda, but at the end of the river day follow your bliss.

Here's what no one is saying in the whitewater world, that you need to hear:

NO SKILL is as important as a Forward Stroke. Not the Eskimo Roll, Not the boof, certainly not the cartwheel, none of that crap. While you are paddling class II and III you should PADDLE through your flatwater instead of floating and bobbing along like all the driftwood out there. It isn't as glamorous, but it will serve you better in the long run, and it will help all the other skill fall into place.

BtW every one's 2 cents have merits, too. This is a mysterious sport in which the lonely unknown paddler who quietly plys his or her craft can learn things that the latest and greatest record breakers don't know, and vice versa.

The Tao that can be named is not the eternal Tao
(Not refereing to Tao Bergman, BTW)

enjoy the journey and don't worry so much about the destination.

mokelumnekid?  Are you a cali boy?

I have a Project 62 and a Dagger Axiom. The Axiom is my favorite boat, but I am not sure I would say it is worth the money if you already have a Mamba (if you plan on keeping the Mamba). The Project has plenty of room in it, but if you don't want to be a playboater it is a bit of overkill.