Well I never considered 520 "Good To Go" and doubt I will now that I have to pay to cross it.

Seattle is one of the final major metropolitan areas in the country devoid of fees for driving around. Roads cost money, and bridges especially so. We are in a budget crunch as a state yet, interestingly, the roads don't stop deteriorating when the state is broke. The solution: pay for the roads you use. Have you ever been to Europe? It costs money to drive on interstates there, calculated based on where you got on and where you get off (talk about getting bent over, 15 Euro for a 2 hour stretch I drove from Italy to France!). Even with the new fees, this is one of the cheapest cities in the world to drive, park, etc. It is only a matter of time before we start seeing more fees on roads, and rightly so. My suggestion? Don't drive so much, take the bus, ride your bike, move closer to your job. Seems that you have figured that out already JP. BTW, you can still drive around on 405, and I90, for now. If you think Seattle is bad, with one toll bridge that you don't have to cross, I suggest never going to the East coast. Ever.

I get a double Quote post - Insert Giant Grin - I will make it short though.

First.

I agree with you 100% in fact I only was posting because the Camera thing is what gets me really pissed. The more we accept the burden of proof being placed on citizens the closer we move to a massive loss of freedom. In fact the affidavit of non responsibility that the City of Renton revised now includes a requirement to name the party responsible. How do you like that, we send you a ticket, fine or infraction notice with nothing more than a picture of your property and now you are responsible to either pay, or find the actual offender. Where did innocent until proven guilty go.

Second

Gonna come at this one two directions.
1. What is the largest financial concern in the world right now besides the Fuel pressure in Libya? The EURO. That might be the only thing that is giving our country a break right now. Collecting more money will never solve anything if you don't control how it is spent, IE if we all pay a 90% income tax and it is given to the IMF do you think our roads are going to get better or kids will learn in new schools... maybe not. Bounce back to Gwendolyn - We all pay for these things through tabs, gas taxes etc.. a new charge is needed because we don't have enough money. Fine get your budget out and make a new charge levy that charge only on the users of this new product, - The first sensible thing we have done - if we could make our system work like that all over the budget we would see why were in shortfalls. Oh perhaps it is because there are too many government services being offered while not enough money is being brought in. How do you think this system operates... The more we have our government do the more money is sliced off for the banks and for the tight little group of trustees. The Euro ain't crashing because they have more services or higher taxes than us, it is crashing and the cost of living there is higher because the people long before us were duped into allowing the Banks to Merge with government in control of fiscal policy. Usury is great until you realize that your paying for someone else not to do anything.

Rant over for now


Edited by James - 23 Feb 2011 at 2:39pm

Besides, a toll on 520 is way better than some blanket tax increase that will affect many people who rarely use the bridge anyway.

Agreed.


And Travissimo I don't understand your point about Washington National Parks and Missouri National Parks. Most National Parks charge fees, and IMO its a good thing they do otherwise they would for sure be "loved" to death. Can you imagine if Yosemite or Mt Rainier were completely free with no restrictions? The whole point of National Parks is to preserve them in the most "natural" state, while still allowing people to enjoy them. The Ken Burns series on PBS illustrated this quite well.

Gates on national forest roads are totally different... constructed for logging operations once the logging is over the FS can't afford to maintain them, clean up the trash people dump, or regulate illegal activities and so they are gated if the public doesn't express recreational interest in keeping them open. See FS62 Procter Creek road up Mt Persis right by Split Rock. That had a gate for a long time because there was massive trash dumping and people shooting guns everywhere leaving shells etc. Hikers interested in climbing Persis and Index worked it out with the FS and now the gate is open again.

In any case, the public can still access NF land no problem even if a road is gated, just on foot. Maybe the No Tresspassing signs you are thinking of are on private land owned by logging companies?


Sorry for the thread drift off topic....

The craziest thing is that most of these are Cameras are run through A.T.S. (American Traffic Solutions) which is based in Tempe AZ.  So basically your city is paying a private corporation to install cameras and write tickets which by the cities authority they enforce and collect then pay a commission to ATS for recording, and on top of all that ATS receives the payments and handles processing. Nice, gives me the chills to know that the city pays a police officer to sit and initial these tickets so they seem to be legitimate.

I talk to more WSDOT and WSP guys then most, and have seen all state money dry up for traffic safety emphasis patrols (the ones that look for DUI's and watch over the construction crews, not the rolling tax levy patrols) outside of the I5/I405 corridor. The whole Seattle/Tacoma area is like a giant siphon when it comes to the traffic infrastructure budget. It pulls money away from the entire state and people outside of the greater Seattle area are getting tired of watching the roads around where they live deteriorate because their tax dollars are mostly going to a geographically small portion of the state.

Personally I am not sure whether or not the Seattle/Tacoma area should get as big a piece of the pie as they do, as it is a massive population/economic center and generates more revenue than places like Mount Vernon, Centralia, or even Spokane. I am certain that the toll road concept is, at least in part, an attempt to raise some revenue to complete a needed infrastructure project with a minimal amount of political backlash.

Nice post Kyle.  I know people over my way are pretty irriatated that most of our money has been going to Seattle roads and not our own (Hwy 2 to be specific).  That's a long time war that we see no end in sight.  I probably make it to Seattle 2 times a year.  I don't mind chipping in for 520 though when I use it.