Professor Paddle: Split Rock access?!

What's going on- word has it (morning Sat., Aug. 27) it is freshly wired and posted no access.

Anyone know what's up?

I know there are ongoing issues with littering, people deciding to have a picnic, human waste, and big dogs. I think mostly non paddlers but people see paddlers using it and assume it's public access. I have had a couple of conversations with the landowner and some correspondence about some alternative signage. Last I spoke to the landowner the problems were increasing.

Tom

We spoke with the land owners this afternoon. Littering was the primary beef. I think the kayakers should start picking up any trash laying wround whenever they are there. They said they don't mind the kayakers, it's generally the other users that cause the issues. Like Tom said, everyone sees us there and they figure it's coll for them to use it also. If the problem keeps up the owners will eventually figure this out and then everyone loses access, unless we keep it clean. I did see them them pick up a couple of beer microbrew beer bottles, and I don't think that was from hell raising kids, I figure there is a good chance those came from boaters (hopefully not). It sucks cleaning up after other people, but if this place is to stay open it has to stay clean.

Jimmy

I think folks also just pull-over and picnic/party, and leave their s-t. Given how close to the road it is, that is *always* going to be a problem that is sometimes bad, sometimes less so.

I for one would be quite happy to give a full day of my time to any project the owners deem useful/worthy if it can somehow allow access. Anyone who has had to drag boats up or down RR Bridge, well, you know what a pain that is. As as levels drop Big Eddy becomes boat abuse and continuing down that after a Main Sky run is not a great option.

How can we help- proactively? What more can we do beside pick-up litter, so that the owners feel added value from boater access?

Jimmy and Tom- did you get the feeling that paddlers are officially excluded from access for now, or is there kind of a wink-wink situation where we can stop by and check or?

Is there an action item here where we can show them some kind of collective love?

George B.

They told us that paddlers are OK to use the place, My gut feel is that if trash remains a problem though everyone could lose access. This is not the first time they have made a fuss about the trash, and sooner or later they will reach their limit and cut off all access.

Jimmy

I'm happy to clean up too, have in the past but not as much as I should, and I've seen others cleaning up too - but it does add up and it seems worse lately.

But, I was wondering, do you know if they want us to give them a heads up when we see people making fires/hanging out there? I know they want that access only for paddlers and I've thought of saying something a few times when I've seen non-kayakers there who looked like they were going to make a mess, but on the other hand you never know if those people are actually friends of the owners or something. It would at least be helpful to know what they would like us to do, or not do, since we're down there all the time. Besides clean up, obviously.

It probably wouldn't hurt to say something, like "this is access by permission only, do you have permission?".

If Split rock becomes a real access issue would it be possible to take out below railroad on river left or would the train people raise hell about that too? I see picnickers using that access all the time and wonder if it might be a better place to pull over because the class V take out/ road crossing is scary enough for me to think about taking out there.

Jed- today I got reacquainted with the RR Bridge access and was again reminded why it suks. And this was under dry conditions. When it is muddy that little steep pitch is especially tricky. (Not as bad as Paradise, but there we have no other options.) But maybe some "trail work" could clean that up? Add a few solid steps? The parking situation there is tight too. I appreciate the terror of the "Hwy 2 Frogger" game at Split Rock, but I still prefer that to RR Bridge.

My concern is that it is inevitable that someday, someone is going to party trash the SR put-in. I am frankly amazed that it hasn't happened already, or that someone hasn't dumped a nice blend of tires, burned sofa and old dryer in there. We can pick up the litter each day but no way to prevent the one-off kind of event that may push the owner to prevent access. How to build-in good will against that day?

I think there is a thread from last year on this topic...I dunno...just one of those things that if it goes away for good, a lot of folks will be thinking- "If only we acted in time..." But what that action is, outside occasional garbage duty, I don't know.

Maybe a legit sign posted:

Private Property: Kayakers Only.
All other douches will be prosecuted to the full extent of the law.

I'm probably way off here... but unless a guard shack is posted or some other sentinel structure is established, I don't see how folks are going to be kept from using that spot to exit the river.

As much as I've used it... and that's more than some, I've never seen an inordinate amount of garbage or trash. Nothing ridiculous or silly... not that there hasn't been some stuff left around, but cmon, nobody is dumping... it all seems way too uptight. Now the owners can do whatever they want, of course...

I've used the takeout downstream often enough and true it's a bit more inconvient but it's access. I've even pulled firewood up from that beach- probably 20 trips up with a load of wood in the arms so it ain't that bad....

At anyrate, it's not like anyone is building a beachfront house there, so I don't see why all the fuss. So whatever, lets see if we can all piss off the owners by throwing a big bonfire party at Split rock .... kegger and all. Lets fill up the parking on both sides, bring out some dirty old mattresses and anything else and then light the night sky up! LOL

Agreed huckin. The garbage never looked that bad to me either- or bad at ALL given how close to the road it is. Just about any stretch of road along there will have a random couple of bottles or misc. crap. But I guess what we think isn't what matters

Also agreed that RR Bridge is not super-evil and some (serious) trail work would clean up the one bad spot (then see the RR folks fence THAT off, kind of surprised they haven't already for liability). But SR is soooo sweet....is all I'm saying. Nice place to put-in for attainments, big warm up pool for Big Eddy runs, lots of room for groups to quickly and easily get in and out. I'd be bummed to lose it.

Originally posted by Blair

Maybe a legit sign posted:

Private Property: Kayakers Only.
All other douches will be prosecuted to the full extent of the law.

Please change this sign to include catarafters and rafters....

I just thought I would remind everyone that when it is your property you view things differently... IE if someone walked through your Yard and tossed a single bottle on the ground and walked away how would you feel? I am sick and tired of people walking their dogs and crapping in my yard, and I even have dogs! The bottom line is that any garbage or trash is trash and an owner is going to be pissed at that, I would be. This year I watched a car full of kids toss a mc donalds bag of trash in my yard as they drove by at around 11pm. Little did they know that I knew where they lived and a few days later after school got out, I sat in my front yard waiting. As they drove by I did this awesome toss right into their sunroof, they stopped we chatted and I explained that I figured I should toss their trash back to them rather than head over to their dads house and give it too him with an explanation. They agreed. I think they were more upset about the fact that I had drizzled some Tuna Oil Lunker Lotion in the bag over night. It was a bit soggy.

Long story short. A simple piece of trash is all it takes. If you all want to make real progress with this try driving in a load of gravel, or stopping by some time and helping maintain the property while the owner is around and aware of our appreciation. It has been done in the past, but guess was I am willing to bet money on the fact that most of the folks posting in this thread won't take a shred of time to do that type of thing, most of you just want to post crap in a thread, and wait to hear someone else did the dirty work.

So rather than talking about all the things we could do to help them, try going out and doing a few. That might go a little farther than idle discussions about picking up a piece of trash the next time your there that won't be credited to boaters anyways.

Sorry for the JP style rant, I just know first hand how boaters in general love to talk but are rarely ever willing to follow through with any type of service related action. Thats a challenge by the way - not a desired expectation.

I will give a six pack to the first person that can name the person that spreads gravel at the takeout, and describe who he is and why he does it. (PS the six pack will be in the form of trash you can pickup)

A couple quick responses. Happy to follow up with anyone who wants more details.

-- I approached the landowner a couple months ago about some signage making it clear that permission was required to use the site and a system for establishing permission. AW would cover the cost on this but sounds like the landowner went with something more general.

-- In the landowners mind situation is getting worse.

-- In addition to litter, big dogs and human waste seem to be primary issues. If you have dogs don't let them out of the car at this site and be sure not to use the site as a bathroom.

-- Get in and out quickly. If you see someone unloading coolers and setting up for a day on the river bank you can politely inform them that this is not a public picnic site.

-- In the past we have looked at purchasing this site (and others). Problem is the poor highway access and after informal consultation with DOT it was pretty clear it would not work for public access. That's a problem all along Highway 2. Formal public access is basically impossible to create. State Parks tried to do a day-use site at the old KOA Campground (just downstream of the NF/SF confluence and upstream of Boulder drop) but could not make it work with the DOT-imposed constraints for access on and off the highway.

-- I have looked at the railroad access and potential trail improvements. The problem there is the railroad owns the property and they are not interested in facilitating access.

-- I will be doing more follow up. Drop me a line if you want more information or want to get more involved.

Thanks Tom!

James, I would like to donate time and or money to the guy who has the gravel brought in!!

I have heard from the FS that they are intending to improve the put in at Cable Drop. any updates on that??

Originally posted by James

Sorry for the JP style rant, I just know first hand how boaters in general love to talk but are rarely ever willing to follow through with any type of service related action.

BTW, that was a generalized statement, Not directed at any one person, just observation from years of pulling paddlers teeth. Tom would be exempt from any such outlandish accusation! If you are mr/mrs/miss/jr/sr community helper give your self a pat on the back, we need more people just like you!

Horner, contact Steve and pay him, he is the one that seems to be doing the work up there. I would also suggest contacting the land owner and showing them the appreciation too!

Holy heck James - great story! That gave me a good laugh - sweet revenge!

I have to upgrade the saying, "revenge is a dish best served....with Tuna Oil Lunker Lotion".

Sorry for the drift.

If there was some way the paddling community could chip in collectively either in terms of $ or some kind of clean up and get access from the landlord - if not formally, at least informally.

Thanks Tom for the FYI.

James- for the record I'm not some lazy f-k who won't put their money, or sweat, where their mouth is. I'm just asking for a little direction on the best way to do that. You experienced locals obviously know *way more* about the situation than I do: who to contact and needful action. Is a load a gravel even something the owner wants? Who IS the owner for chrissakes? Etc., etc.

Originally posted by James

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The bottom line is that any garbage or trash is trash and an owner is going to be pissed at that, I would be.

This year I watched a car full of kids toss a mc donalds bag of trash in my yard as they drove by at around 11pm. Little did they know that I knew where they lived and a few days later after school got out, I sat in my front yard waiting. As they drove by I did this awesome toss right into their sunroof, they stopped we chatted and I explained that I figured I should toss their trash back to them rather than head over to their dads house and give it too him with an explanation. They agreed. I think they were more upset about the fact that I had drizzled some Tuna Oil Lunker Lotion in the bag over night. It was a bit soggy.

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Originally posted by James

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If you all want to make real progress with this try driving in a load of gravel, or stopping by some time and helping maintain the property while the owner is around and aware of our appreciation. It has been done in the past, but guess was I am willing to bet money on the fact that most of the folks posting in this thread won't take a shred of time to do that type of thing, most of you just want to post crap in a thread, and wait to hear someone else did the dirty work.So rather than talking about all the things we could do to help them, try going out and doing a few. That might go a little farther than idle discussions about picking up a piece of trash the next time your there that won't be credited to boaters anyways.

Sorry for the JP style rant, I just know first hand how boaters in general love to talk but are rarely ever willing to follow through with any type of service related action. Thats a challenge by the way - not a desired expectation. I will give a six pack to the first person that can name the person that spreads gravel at the takeout, and describe who he is and why he does it. (PS the six pack will be in the form of trash you can pickup)<a href="css_styles/default_style.

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James, I couldn'tve said it any better myself. I found it refreshing to read an was glad to hear someone else say it!

Then to be quoted as being the inspiration for it? Boy was I flattered
But seriously-

It is good that folks from this community are talking about it and concerned. I hate garbage and other inappropriately disposed of waste and would be bummed if such factors shut down access.

As far as garbage goes, often when I encounter garbage somewhere where it bothers me, I pick it up. Beyond that I strive to be as Leave No Trace as possible always, everywhere.

Guys- don't take it personal unless you should. James just raisied an obvious point.

Originally posted by mokelumnekid

...I appreciate the terror of the "Hwy 2 Frogger" game at Split Rock, but I still prefer that to RR Bridge.My concern is that it is inevitable that someday, someone is going to party trash the (Split Rock) Put In.

Yeah, I've seen it pretty bad a few times at random times.

But I'm more concerned about the complexity of the " Highway 2 Frogger". Apparently we have advanced to the next level. The last think anyone needs is to make that traffic bulletin board reset at "day 1" since last accident.

So that brings us back to how we utilize the site with our vehicles and our parking.

We must all endeavor to park in a space conscious way to ensure people can enter and exit on and off Hwy 2 safely, and maximize the available space. Better yet manage your logistics more intelligently to minimize the amount of cars left down there.

Get in and get out. Which reminds me....

That reminds me of who has really done the most on our behalf, as far as Split Rock and all sorts of stuff:

Originally posted by okeefe

-- I approached the landowner a couple months ago about some signage making it clear that permission was required to use the site and a system for establishing permission. AW would cover the cost on this but sounds like the landowner went with something more general.

-- In the landowners mind situation is getting worse.

-- In addition to litter, big dogs and human waste seem to be primary issues. If you have dogs don't let them out of the car at this site and be sure not to use the site as a bathroom.

-- Get in and out quickly. If you see someone unloading coolers and setting up for a day on the river bank you can politely inform them that this is not a public picnic site.

-- In the past we have looked at purchasing this site (and others). Problem is the poor highway access and after informal consultation with DOT it was pretty clear it would not work for public access. That's a problem all along Highway 2. Formal public access is basically impossible to create. State Parks tried to do a day-use site at the old KOA Campground (just downstream of the NF/SF confluence and upstream of Boulder drop) but could not make it work with the DOT-imposed constraints for access on and off the highway.

-- I have looked at the railroad access and potential trail improvements. The problem there is the railroad owns the property and they are not interested in facilitating access.

-- I will be doing more follow up. Drop me a line if you want more information or want to get more involved.

And one way to support Tom is by joining AW and keeping it current if you can afford the small anual amount. I did, and I don't have much bling at all. But I know it is well spent. Tom has a proven track record for resolving issues surrounding access to the satisfaction of both land owners and paddlers.

The important point to make here is this: Let's let Tom be the liason with the land owner so that our community interests have a clear and unified voice.

Otherwise "Get In and Out Quickly" as he said.
Be low impact. And yeah, you wanna pick up a piece o trash even better.

Thanks for that- Tom is there an overt action item that seems warranted at this time when the owner feels especially sensitive? If not I'll keep my yapper shut, and just do what seems right at the time. And thanks for all that AWA does.

(On the lighter side, I had this vision of pulling up to SR and seeing a sign- "All Access Closed- Someone Dumped Gravel All Over The Place") Doah!