So after years of work our rafting movie Habitat is finished.

35 years of rafting history in the northwest told by legends like Shane Turnbull, Val Shaull, Jeff Bennett and 30 other of the areas paddlers.

Pre-orders can be purchased at www.redshackproductions.com shipping begins may 5!






Edited by slickhorn - 03 Apr 2012 at 2:07pm

that sucks it worked when i first posted it, someone linked it to something, i dont now. if you type www.redshackproductions.com in your self you will get a site that works! i got a discounted version for you jp since you came up with the name and all.

Just ordered my copy of the movie!   

crank the hip hop gnar gnar gnar ... lol.

All these questions about who is interviewed... well they showed at least 4 or 5 people in the trailer which could possibly mean they interviewed quite a few people. Did they interview the bashkaus brothers, did they interview the Beckers, did they interview Slickhorns dad and mum?

Clearly not every person contributing to the video can be in the trailer, but the fact that they included Shane and several others shows that they are not focusing on just the last couple years hotshots (hip hop gnar gnar gnar) but rather more of a heritage journey.

There was a clip of a cat boat with oars (could be ID) towards the end of the trailer and while you might be right that it is not the focus of the film I would be surprised if it were ignored all together.

Paddle Boating is different than Rowing, Cat boats are different than Rafts, but Rafting certainly covers both rowing and paddle boating. The title is "35 years of whitewater rafting in the Pacific Northwest" So why do you want to know why they did not include more cat boats in the trailer? Heck if you want to get accurate about labeling based on the trailer, the flick should be called. "An old dude and a Green Aire" ...

Not trying to give you a hard time but it seems like your complaining about things that contradict themselves. Here is a map of what Wikipedia considers the PacNW


Put your little mouse in the middle of what you see on that map, your either going to be around Metaline Falls, (not white water meca, or close too hood river or the wenatchee)

I would argue calling that the pacific northwest is not a stretch. But to keep with my nasty trend of rebutles , lets just settle on.

"33.2 years of two man whitewater paddle rafting focused on the greater Columbia and Fraser Drainages with additional Footage from outer lying areas within the continent of North America highlighting British Columbia, Washington and Oregon, although Idaho, Montana, Utah, California, Colorado and Arizona might be mentioned"

Can we fit that on a DVD box. Wait a minute is this going to be a DVD or Bluray. Can I get it on Netflix or Vudu, because I think the term Video these days includes those forms of media too.

Brian - I appreciate the quick reply. 

Given your posts here, Idahowhitewater, etc, you generally seem like a very thoughtlful individual with very similar perspectives on rivers to my own.  I am also aware of some of your personal experiences with folks in the movie.  I think the latter may have influenced your rapid and oblique reply to my post.  I respectfully ask you to take a deep breath and digest the content that follows....

I find the defensive tone of your post to be somewhat out-of-character and am assuming you target a broader audience.  Unfortunately, you didn't answer any of my questions.  

To be clear, my original post is not an attack on the film (if you re-read, you will find several compliments).  I asked several fairly specific questions that, depending on the specific answers, will inform my decision to purchase or not.  I was/am seeking information on how well the promotional text and trailer characterize the movie's content.

Jeff Benett (via his book) and Val Shaull (via personal conversation), made me aware of the two specific instances I asked about.  Given that Jeff and Val are advertised as being interviewed in the movie, is it not unreasonable to  inquire if those early descents of Robe's and the Truss are included?

As for accessibility to information, it is true that it can be very difficult to find historical information, particularly given the frequently transient lifestyles in space and time of those involved.  However, many of the guys that logged most of the early raft descents of the gnarlier Idaho runs (as well as a few elsewhere) are still active and are arguably much easier to find than many paddle-guides.  As you are aware, Ted Day and Jerry Kiser are active on the Idahowhitewater list.  Mark Cramer occasionally posts to that list as well.  Alan Hamilton has owned AIRE inflatables since it's inception about 20 years ago.  As such, I don't think your claim that information is hard to find necessarily holds up in these instances.  That said....

If the makers of the movie made the decision (conscious or unconscious) to focus on paddle-rafting only, that's perfectly acceptable.  I'm not judging that decision.  I only ask if that's the decision that was made.

If there is no content from Idaho...again, perfectly acceptable. 

If you (or others) could specifically address my questions, I'd be most grateful.

Thanks,
Will

Ordered, and really looking forward to seeing the film.  Working on my own plans for a documentary, and really excited to see your work.

Thanks!

Brian - Guess I should have hit "Refresh" before my most recent post.  I'm the guy two cubicles behind you (toothy grin).  Nah, I'm just an internet lurker that tends to run solo or in small groups.  Last name is Conley....I'm not very successful at staying web-dead, but I do aspire to something closer perhaps to web-comatose...tough to do when asking unpopular questions though, I guess.

The guy you're thinking of (boatman that rowed the Truss in a SB) is Will Volpert.  After paddle-boating the Truss about 7 or 8 years ago, I quickly concluded that while it was certainly possible possible to row most of it, that there were alot of other places I would prefer to apply the effort.  There's good reason that there was a 10+ year gap in between the first oared descent of the Truss and when the Beckers, Volpert, etc went in....the folks that have oared it have definitely earned it. 

"The most uncool thing you can do is run an inflatable, or god forbid, row.  it's just not ever going to be cool in the same way."

That's awesome and, never having been one of the cool kids, succinctly explains my gravitation to rowing.  While rowing is my preferred form of aquatic locomotion, exploration is my fundamental motivation, so I try to pick the right tool for the job be it cat, paddle-boat, or IK (a bad back and shoulders keep me out of hardshells though). 

I think your interpretation (paragraph 3) is generally accurate.  However, since I was intrigued by the historical nature of this particular effort, I was trying not to jump to the conclusion that "kayakers making a rafting film is gonna focus on the kinds of water kayak culture value".  so I figured I'd ask some questions (I didn't even realize that Hans kayaked...just thought he was a bad-azz paddle-boater).

I apologize if my original questions were too pointed or implied their own tone. As one that writes mostly technical language, I sometimes miss my own tone.  That said,

"we havn't seen the film, so none of us can answer." would have been a great original reply.  I don't keep up with release dates, screenings etc, but thought I'd seen reference to it being shown somewhere...my fault for not being more informed.  Between a full-time job, various volunteer activities, and a couple of kids, I can't keep up with all the hoopla.  Ah, who am I kidding....I can't blame that stuff, I didn't keep up even before any of that came along... 

Cheers,
Will C.

"I mean your suggesting the name is wrong"

No.  While I'm not sure about "Habitat" as a title, I'm not questioning it.  Being somewhat simple, I miss all sorts of allegory, allusion, and other literary techniques my 9th grade english teacher thought were important.

"that they did not include the right amount of footage of certain things and then wondering if the title is misleading based on a short trailer" 

Yes.  Hence my question to the forum figuring that someone had seen the film and be able to provide an indication how representative the trailer was of the movie.  My fault for not tracking release dates etc and realizing that noone has seen it.

In other words, if the trailer features 99% paddle-boats and the movie features 99% paddle-boats, it's highly representative.  And I probably won't spend the $25.  If the trailer features 99% paddle boats, but 10% of the actual movie features oar boats, then I might consider spending the $25.  25 or 30% oar boats and I'll definitely spend the $25.  Understand?

In my opinion, a film that describes itself as being about rafting history in the introductory sentence and does not include all forms of rafting is mischaracterizing itself. 

That said, I do not know this to be the case for "Habitat"...my hope is that it does include some of those early oar-efforts.  If not video, at least some interviews...just throw us un-cool kids a little bone.  If it doesn't, I can certainly understand that films cost money to make, waterfalls sell, and folks like myself constitute a very small market.  Hopefully, the producers will similarly appreciate if their movie does not cover a certain scope, that my $25 will be reserved for gas-money to go boating. 

Cheers,
Will

PS.  The Nomex fleece is called DragonFur:
http://www.truenorthgear.com/product_listing.php?path=0_8
It's pretty spendy, but my job-shirt is one of the most comfortable things I own.  It is a very dense fleece, so not something I will be packing on mulit-days though.  My beanie has tested well so far with embers from several burn-piles.  DragonFur meets NFPA 1977 (2005), but my chief hasn't committed to whether or not it's legit for me to where on the line yet.  True North is out of Seattle, so maybe there is a factory store that sells seconds up there?  Occasionally you can find it on sale at some of the wildland fire supply outfits (e.g. Supply Cache).


Edited by willfish - 11 Apr 2012 at 1:13pm

Thank you everyone for all the bumps, positive or negative. in the beginning i inquired with Idaho boaters and nor cal boater if they consider them self's northwest boaters and in ever case they said no we are Idaho and nor cal boaters.the story of rafting in the area took 35 years to write and we are telling it in a hour and 10 mins so there is no way to include everybody. as far as first descents go that is not the story we are telling instead we let the 40 or so people we interview tell that. also there were very few video boaters 35 years ago so we had to role with what old video we could find. as far as the trailer goes it was made before we restored the old footage so yes you will see oars on rafts and catboats and even some paddle cats. if you have more ?'s about history that couldn't fit in the movie please introduce your self to me at any one of the northwest events. rendering begins tomorrow evening then off to the press. it was great seeing many of you this weekend and to see your excitement for the film.       

Edited by red shack - 11 Apr 2012 at 4:28pm

Red Shack (if that is, in fact, your real name ) - thank-you for the direct answers. 

That's awesome you guys have restored old footage.  That's what I'll pay to see.  Thought I'd read it was 30 min....didn't realize it was an hour and ten.  That's a serious effort.  To be clear, while I did question the appropriateness of the subtitle/intro based on what I saw in the trailer, there was no challenge or negativity by me toward your overall effort (despite the assertions of others).  I look forward to seeing it.

Cheers,
Will

willfish, Jerry Redell makes a rare raft descent of Robe Canyon in Bennett's book. Don't know if he's in the movie or not. I'm guessing not.

When I emerged from my cave this morning and was still a bit puzzled by the vigor of some of yesterday’s replies. So I scratched myself a bit, poured me out a bowl of corn chex, and thought….(cue harps and dream sequence):

So, let's say I make a film called, "Waterworld - A 35 year history of whitewater kayaking in the Northwest".  I promote it with 1) a 4 minute trailer that shows nothing but creek-boating and 2) a text description that mentions specific individuals, but doesn’t describe more universally understood styles or types of whitewater kayaking. 

Would someone from the Peanut Gallery be out of line for saying, "Hey brah, is there any playboating?”,  “ You gonna show footy from when Johnny TwoPaddles threw down that sick doubledicktwister-with-a-super-loop at the SkyFest rodeo in '99?" etc, etc.

Thank you for taking time out of your busy life to insult me on the internet, but I don't much care for troll bait.

Peace, love, brotherhood.