Whitewater Forum: Near Miss
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Near Miss

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Forum Name: Whitewater Forum
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URL: http://www.professorpaddle.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=10442
Printed Date: 23 Apr 2024 at 4:20pm


Topic: Near Miss
Posted By: Scott_H
Subject: Near Miss
Date Posted: 30 Jan 2011 at 10:31pm

I had a near miss on Saturday.  I am sharing this long-post for two reasons: one, hearing about experiences both good and bad is what I believe makes this board, and the community it serves, invaluable; and two, I hope that the exercise of writing this may help me process the experience.

The hard thing for me to believe is that it didn’t happen on some run that was at the upper end of my ability or on a move that required difficult paddling.  I ended up getting caught in a hole on the Middle Middle right above House Rocks.  I have been boating for 6 years and have probably run this stretch 100+ times.  I don’t often run it at the level it was at on Saturday (3400), but it was not a level that I really had much concerns about and was paddling with confidence up to that point. 

I was following my friends Jay and Mark as we approached the entry boulder of House Rocks from river right.  I watched Jay finish the first half, and then Mark.  They had both gone to the left of a hole in the center.  I wasn’t really thinking much of the hole.  I was in my Pyranha Burn and it seems to handle meatier holes well.  I actually still don’t remember going over the lip and what went wrong, but I do vividly recall suddenly side-surfing a fairly deep and violent hole.  I knew I was in for a bit of a ride, though not panicking.  I rolled after a short bit and while I was upside down, I stretched out and tried to grab the current beneath with my paddle.  I felt the water go calm and so thinking I was free I rolled up only to find myself being pulled back in and again side-surfing.  Despite the chaos, I remember still being calm enough to get some deep breaths knowing I would likely be swimming.  The next time I rolled over, I went for the loop.

I don’t recall this, but according to Jay, my boat came free and I surfaced and broke free from that hole.  However, to my terrible misfortune, I immediately swam into another hole below it.  Jay will have to chime in, but I believe he said I was down for maybe 20 seconds.  It seemed like an eternity for me.  I don’t know if I got much of a breath in that moment between, but I was exhausted after exiting the boat and really short of breath.  I was stuck deep enough in the hole so even when I surfaced at the bottom of it I was swallowing a lot of water and not getting any meaningful breaths.  I wasn’t panicking too much at first; I was confident I would get free shortly.  But I was stuck in a horrible re-circulating pattern.  Each time I was pulled back to the depth of the hole, I became shorter and shorter on breath and kept swallowing more and more water.  I was fighting it, trying hard to swim at the right moments, only to get thrown back in.

The last re-circulation was the point in time that is still very fresh in my memory.  I didn’t get a breath as I was pulled back in, but I desperately needed one.  I was lower in the water than the previous cycles and couldn’t get my head to the surface, but could feel myself still being held.  I am having problems describing the exact feelings from that moment, maybe panic, maybe disbelief, but I do remember having three very distinct and rapid thoughts:   one, I was drowning; two, I remembered hearing that drowning ends up being peaceful once you stop fighting (and I had almost no fight left); and three, I felt very bad for my family and friends having to deal with me drowning on them.

I can only speculate why, but right after that, I broke free and surfaced.  According to Jay I surfaced in the current down a bit from the hole.  I had no energy left at that point.  Mark and Jay had immediately known I was in trouble and were paddling up to me.  I was exhausted and actually don’t remember if I swam or grabbed one of their boats to get to shore, but it was thankfully a very short swim to shore from when I surfaced.  I collapsed on the bank for a few seconds and then just sat there coughing up water.  Jay went on to get my gear once he determined I was going to be ok.  The rest was your routine swim drill.  Jay did a wonderful job running down and successfully getting my boat and paddle and Mark wouldn’t leave me as I stumbled along the river bank.

I was probably in some form of shock or denial about what had just happened until I got home and sat down next to my wife.  On the drive home I had planned on just giving her a matter of fact account of the incident and what I was going to say; she is very patient and supportive of me and deserves to know about the close call.  But when I actually sat down next to her on the couch to give my pre-rehearsed account, I couldn’t get more than 2 words out of my mouth before I just lost it for the next couple of minutes.  I felt even worse seeing how scared I made her.  I spent the rest of the day in a fog.  We went to a 4 year olds birthday party, then a family dinner, then to see a friend’s band play.  But the whole rest of the day was surreal to me.

My wife and I have talked more about it today.  I have thought about it for too many hours as well; replaying the incident over and over and trying to gain some perspective about what happened.   I could probably write a few more pages about what I have been thinking since Saturday morning. 

I wasn’t sure about posting this at first.  I could have just as well done this exercise in an email to a few friends.  I also thought that if everyone wrote about getting worked on the Middle Middle or the Sky, we’d soon be deluged with posts.  But while I have had my fair share of swims and thrashings in the past, I have never come close to the despair I felt yesterday.  In sober (when I sobered) hindsight, I can say with certainty it was a close call.  So, maybe the intended purpose of this post is to offer a reminder that this sport we love is filled with more random dangers than most others.  An “average” day on an “average” stretch of a river has the potential to be anything but.

 



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“The problem with people who have no vices is that generally you can be pretty sure they're going to have some pretty annoying virtues.”



Replies:
Posted By: Travisimo
Date Posted: 31 Jan 2011 at 12:23am
Glad to hear you're okay!  My closest call to date came in Boulder Drop, I think in 2001...

It changed my perspective on some things, but didn't stop my paddling.  I hope it doesn't for you either.


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H2O please


Posted By: doggievacation
Date Posted: 31 Jan 2011 at 7:04am
Scott,

Glad to hear you're okay.  And thanks for posting this.  A lot of people seem to think that swims in Class III/III+ water don't have consequences, but any bad swim can really set you back.  After all, what you're dealing with now is straight up PTSD and it does take time to process.  I had a near drowning experience back in 2004 (borrowed a friend's boat and COULD NOT get my skirt to pop while I was upside down and getting worked.)  I hate to say it, but took a long, long time for that little worm of fear to finally work itself out of my system.

My advice is to boat when you feel ready and stick to nice, familiar runs.  Make sure you have fun EVERY TIME you boat and steer clear of any drop that makes you feel panicky.  If you can do that, I think you'll find the worm will fade on its own, but go with your gut and take your time.  The whole point of this sport is to have fun!

Good luck,
John


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Don't waste water!


Posted By: rockarolla
Date Posted: 31 Jan 2011 at 7:21am
Glad to here your ok brother !
 
 


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Dave Moroles.   253 241 8550.


Posted By: wylddeuces2
Date Posted: 31 Jan 2011 at 7:31am
Wow, Im glad you're alright and its great you were able to share your experience with us!  I could not begin to imagine what it'd be like under water like that! Im a new paddler waiting to get in my boat.

Two years ago i had my life flash before my eyes as well, laying in the middle of an intersection with my Harley on my leg in the middle of rush hour traffic, there must have been better plans for me, as there was Oil all over the road which caused mine and all the other car accidents... i should have been ran over by the other cars. Amazingly I'm still here, a Lot i don't remember, some kinda mental block for almost that entire year i suppose its probably from the concussion.

In the long run... it has given me a new outlook on how special our Lives are. Never take anything for granite and im blessed everyday to still be a part of my childs lives.... I think to myself since the accident, What more could i give of myself? So i raised my right hand and signed my life over to the army, I couldn't be Happier!!!

You sharing your experience helps other heal from their own, or me from mine.
Thanks again for telling your story!








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To each their own. If it makes you happy it cant be that bad, im happy for you! For what does matter...is what makes You happy!


Posted By: James
Date Posted: 31 Jan 2011 at 9:08am
Scott,

I am glad to hear your ok and posting your account is sobering for everyone. When I read through your post, I think of two things right away.

First is that like John said, class XXX does not mean there is no danger and it is important  we are all aware of that easily forgotten fact. When you run a stretch 100+ times it is easy to see how we can loose sight of it.

Second is that river levels have a huge amount to do with the danger on a run. Although we are eager to find that prime level it does often mean that the run can become more dangerous. That is one of the things that I think many paddlers debate and it does not do much benefit. Loads of folks are quick to claim some giant flow as being prime or their favorite level but in reality it might easily turn the difficulty of a river up a notch with the consequences of a swim significantly higher.

Regardless of all the experiences and lessons we learn on the river our friendships and families should always be the most important so thanks for sharing, and Well Done  Jay and Mark it sounds like you guys were the icon of paddling partners.


Posted By: JayB
Date Posted: 31 Jan 2011 at 9:21am
I may have more to add later, but I'll add a couple of quick thoughts and impressions:

-The first is that during the second phase of the swim Scott was down so long that an entrapment seemed like the only possibility.

-The second is that group dynamics matter. Most of us are pretty good about keeping tabs on others in our party, maintaining spacing that allows for visual contact and some kind of communication, and regrouping when appropriate. Mark, Scott, and I just kind of do this automatically when we're together - and because of that Mark and I were able to get to Scott just a few seconds after he resurfaced.


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-Jay


Posted By: water wacko
Date Posted: 31 Jan 2011 at 9:24am
I'm glad you're okay, Scott.

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"Don't ask yourself what the world needs. Ask yourself what makes you come alive, and go do that, because what the world needs is people who have come alive." ~Howard Thurman


Posted By: jella
Date Posted: 31 Jan 2011 at 11:08am
I'm really glad to hear that your okay.

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Posted By: Wiggins
Date Posted: 31 Jan 2011 at 11:18am
Low risk does not mean risk free. My two scariest experiences kayaking happened on the Powerhouse run on the Snoqualmie, and the class II section of the S Fk of the Snoqualmie. Ledge Drop 2 on the Green still gets my pulse pumping because I once had an accidental swim there with full waders.
 
The important thing is that  you are ok, and when it all went sideways everyone (yourself included from the sounds of it) did the right thing to maximize your chances of survival.
 
If you haven't made an appointment already you may want to go to the doctor to make sure your lungs are ok and aren't about to have a parking lot drowning.
 
I am glad you are alright.
 
Kyle


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I smell bacon


Posted By: Kyle K
Date Posted: 31 Jan 2011 at 11:32am

Hey Scott, glad you're safe and sound and you had such good padlling partners! Here are a couple of thoughts about this situation:

House Rocks at roughly 3-7k is a pretty serious rapid, despite the sometimes cavalier attitude some of us can have after running it a bunch of times. My personal take it that it is easier at lower and higher water. I think it's important for all of us to remember that any moving water can be dangerous, depending on where we end up (in your case in two sticky holes).
 
I'm going to suggest something that might help you get back on the horse: Put on our drysuit and practice swimming some relatively safe rapids just to get the feel back. Most of us have swum often enough to think we know how to handle it but getting worked is a different ball game. There's only one way to be super comfortable with it and that's to practice. Start out slow and then maybe find a hole that you're comfortable you can get out of and jump into it a time or two.
 
You didn't mention trying anything in particular to get out of the holes, although you may have. Two techniques that have worked for me are the following:
1. Curl up in a tight ball to help you sink to the (hoepfully) exiting water near the river bed. You go deep but tend to rise up downstream of the bubble line (water returning into the hole). This works best in bigger violent holes.
2. If you can get flat (maybe not possible in the holes you were in), swim accross the eddy line into the downstream current, rolling your body as you do (from a breast stroke to a back stroke or vice versa). This works best in flattish pourover style holes.
 
I'm sure there are other techniques that others can chime in on. Again, as much as we all hate to swim, only practice makes perfect, or at least leads to some level of comfort in sticky situations.
 
Keep boating and again, I'm glad it worked out OK in the end. Take care!


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"I used to be somebody, now I'm somebody else." Bad Blake                  


Posted By: Jed Hawkes
Date Posted: 31 Jan 2011 at 11:52am
I will echo what kyle K said, recreational swimming is an integral part of learning to get comfortable.  jP and I have done a lot of recreational swimming this summer raft guiding.  We're all told/taught to swim in moving current but it does us no good until we actually do it on a regular basis.

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The line will become apparent
978-273-7723


Posted By: Leland
Date Posted: 31 Jan 2011 at 12:21pm
In my experience, the more you fight to swim out of a hole, the more it sucks you back in. Going limp is often the best thing you can do to get out of a hole.

Beyond that, swimming up into the water entering the hole can also serve to drive you deep into the outflow.

Glad you made it out. Hopefully these tips can help to make your next hole swim less epic.


Posted By: doggievacation
Date Posted: 31 Jan 2011 at 12:54pm
I'll probably catch a lot of flack for this comment, but part of me thinks that practicing how to swim a hole is like practicing how to crash a car.  I don't want to do either one, so I'd rather spend my time practicing how NOT to do it, then how to do it safely.

That said, I have swum rapids before as part of a SWR class, and I'll probably do it again soon as I'm due for another class this year.  (It's been four years.)


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Don't waste water!


Posted By: tradguy2
Date Posted: 31 Jan 2011 at 1:16pm
Scott, this reminds a lot me of a swim I had on the Cle Elum last summer.  After get beat down a hole for a long time I pulled my skirt and tried to swim to the surface.  I remember grabbing the smooth rock under the pour over, swimming hard, and generally doing whatever I could to get air but I just could not get to the surface.  At some point I started wondering if this was going be the end of me (my lungs were really burning) so I stopped fighting for a second to think when suddenly I came up a distance downstream.
I find it interesting that we both flushed after relaxing because it reinforces my theory that the reason I wasn't flushing is that I was fighting too much to go deep and sub out.  Once I relaxed I suspect I went deeper a flushed.  

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... preparing for a river beating!     


Posted By: Kyle K
Date Posted: 31 Jan 2011 at 1:27pm
Hey There Doggie,
 
No offense intended, and I'm not trying to give you any sh*t but I'm confused: First you say you don't want to swim in a hole, then you say you are going to practice how to do it. My confusion is this: How does one practice without actually doing it?
 
As I mentioned, the best way to do it is in a relatively safe hole. Close to shore, with safety people in place would be ideal. It can actually be a bunch of fun. Seriously, get a group of river pals together on an off day and go for it. Guaranteed you'll laugh a lot and learn something to boot.
 
In CO, where I live now, there are a bunch of WW parks that have features of various strength. Although I've never witnessed one strong enough to keep you for long, especially since they design them to be safe, some of the holes can toss you around a bit before they let you go. They're perfect to practice swimming in.
 
Another place to work on it can be the ocean. There are an entirely different set of parameters for picking a safe spot but breaking waves can be fun too.
 
Again, not slinging sh*t. I just think we as a community ought to practice swimming more as, more often than we like to admit, we all swim sooner or later. And, to quote Steve Fisher (as best I can remember it) "We're all in between swims. As you get better they just get further apart and scarier."


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"I used to be somebody, now I'm somebody else." Bad Blake                  


Posted By: doggievacation
Date Posted: 31 Jan 2011 at 3:48pm
Kyle,

No offense taken.  I guess my conflicting views boil down to this:  On the whole, I think a lot of boaters don't take swimming very seriously.  It's no big deal.  It just happens.

But, of course, it doesn't "just happen."  Usually, it happens because your roll needs work or because you were boating water above your current skill level.  And, yeah, sometimes sh*t just happens, but I would argue that bad luck plays a lesser role than people would like to think.  So my thesis, if you want to pin me down, is that the way to prevent a bad swim is through practicing rolling and boating skills, not by practicing swimming skills. 

But here comes the part where I reverse myself:  sh*t does happen.  We all have bad days and sometimes we're the guy who ends up having the kind of scary swim Scott just had.    So, yeah, it's a good idea to practice swimming through rapids or out of holes.  It could happen to any of us and we should be prepared for it.  But if push comes to shove, I'd rather be known as a good, safe boater than a good, safe swimmer.





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Don't waste water!


Posted By: Scott_H
Date Posted: 31 Jan 2011 at 4:15pm
Thanks everybody - this has been very helpful to hear.  I had my take on things, but it was so very subjective I really needed some context and other people's viewpoints to help make sense of it.  I have been emailing Jay today back and forth and need to sit down with he and Mark and re-hash things and talk about how to use this
experience for future trips.
 
Just some random, still jumbled thoughts:
 
I will definitely boat again in the not-too-distant future.  I spent to much money on boats not to.
 
 
Tom (and others) - I think you are right, the moment when I paused (or quit ) was the moment I stopped moving and sank and broke free.  Also, because I had no air left in me, I think I was naturally lower in water.  But the scary part is that I knew about the "going deep" concept before Saturday, but I overrode it for the most part in my quest to desperately catch a breath.  The self-image of being held with my head just below the surface straining to get up is going to stay with me for a while.
 
I agree on the benefits of some swim practice.  Thankfully, I spent my younger years on swim team, so I have some base skills.  But I have also taken two Swiftwater classes in my 6 years of boating.  Each has been very helpful and they emphasized swimming rapids.  I do need to get out there, if even just at the end of a run and just pop into the water for a spot and swim.  Maybe even have someone practice throwing the rope to me.  You could certainly expand that and make it a combo run\drill day.
 
I also agree with the "safe boater" concept.  I took some comfort that I was able to immediately side surf and roll up in the maw of the hole without thinking about it.  I attribute that to sidesurfing random features from time to time on runs.  I want it to be automatic like my roll (not saying the roll is always automatic) and will spend more time focusing on having the boat in awkward positions and dealing with it.
 
I could have scouted - boat scout, or even on the banks.  That level was a little unfamiliar with me.  A quick jump out seems like a small hassle now.
 
Having good partners and this board are wonderful. 
 
 
 
 


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“The problem with people who have no vices is that generally you can be pretty sure they're going to have some pretty annoying virtues.”


Posted By: Jed Hawkes
Date Posted: 31 Jan 2011 at 5:14pm
A common place to practice this sort of "recreational swimming" is on the cle elum below the take out for the China Gorge. There is an eddyline that is commonly used as a mystery move spot, ie. pencil diving into the eddyline for big downtime, it's super fun but do it at lower water when the cooper is in. Apparently James went there with his squirtboat at the higher end and got a little too much downtime.

And just to reinforce the rec swimming, swimming in whitewater is about more than being a good swimmer, but knowing how to swim in whitewater. For example knowing when to lay on your back and be passive, and when to roll on your belly and swim hard. It also helps to learn how well your body planes through the water, and how to catch eddies efficiently with your body.

It is easy for me to preach this because I come from 5 years of raft guiding experience and have done lots of swimming and teaching people that have no whitewater experience how to swim in moving water. And I'm sorry for being preachy but this skill is a commonly ignored whitewater skill. It will also be helpful if your ever on a run where you become separated from your boat and end up on the wrong side of the river and are forced to swim to your boat or to the other side of the river so you can walk out.

I've been in a similar situation to you minus the scary stuff. I swam at Lava falls on the farmlands section of the White Salmon and for a few moments I tumbled around fighting the current before I remembered to do the cannonball. As soon as I tucked the falls pushed me deep and I resurfaced downstream. The hardest thing when swimming is remembering your training and fighting your instincts. Once on shore I discovered that my boat was downstream with a class IV rapid between me and it, and was forced to swim back to my craft. At this moment I was glad that I had had practice swimming without my boat.

In the two years guiding on the White Salmon I've had a handfull of swimmers at Husum falls. I always train them to "do the cannonball" if they are having trouble surfacing because they feel like they're "in a washing machine". And every single one of them has fought the current initially, then after a bit remembered what I taught them and then do the cannonball. They get back in the boat and spit and cough for a few minutes, then look at me and say "you were right about that cannonball thing".

I've also had success swimming upstream into the hole and then balling up once I hit the seam, that way you really get into the green water flushing downstream.

I hope that all this is helpful and that we can all learn from your experience, even if we don't learn from it, at least we're reminded of the risk.

Take care.

-Jed

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The line will become apparent
978-273-7723


Posted By: JayB
Date Posted: 31 Jan 2011 at 5:41pm
-Having a hard time thinking of a hydraulic that fits the bill here in Western WA. Like the idea but worry about getting into a real-deal retention/entrapment situation... 

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-Jay


Posted By: jella
Date Posted: 31 Jan 2011 at 8:38pm
there are plenty over on the Wenatchee River....

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Posted By: James
Date Posted: 31 Jan 2011 at 10:11pm
Body surfing at paradise is good stuff and then you can swim in the whirlpools below it ... see how deep you can go and hang out in the eddy. practice making the ferry etc... I have had many a good day wrapped up with a 20-30 minute swim sesh there.


Posted By: tiziak
Date Posted: 01 Feb 2011 at 7:49am
Lunch hole on the sky is a good place to get worked in your boat. That thing will hand out a beating if you let it.

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If you don't know where you are going, any road will get you there.

Daniel Patrinellis
360.434.4616


Posted By: water wacko
Date Posted: 01 Feb 2011 at 8:00am
Swim the Needle at the right flow and you'll surface about 200 yards off shore... in the ocean.    

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"Don't ask yourself what the world needs. Ask yourself what makes you come alive, and go do that, because what the world needs is people who have come alive." ~Howard Thurman


Posted By: chipmaney
Date Posted: 01 Feb 2011 at 8:47am
Scott, glad to hear you are okay.  Such events can definitely cause a crisis of confidence. Hang in there, friend; once you put together a new string of positive kayaking days, I am sure you will be get back to having fun and feeling good about being on the river.

Good luck & see you on the river.




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sitting all alone on a mountain by a river that has no end


Posted By: huckin harms
Date Posted: 01 Feb 2011 at 8:56am
Scott,
 
Glad you're ok.  Those kinds of experiences are the ones that make you question your reasons for doing what you love to do.  It can be tough to rebound from that... as previously mentioned =some form of ptsd.  Some folks would hang it all up following that kind of event. 
 
It's not surprising to hear that you finally flushed at the time you relaxed and 'quit the fight'.  That certainly has been my experience when circulating in the drowning machine... best thing to do is relax and hope, conserve that precious energy.  An easy thing to say or type but difficult at best when in the moment of crisis. 
 
I don't know if you said so... but, were you wearing a drysuit?  Not that it makes alot of difference or does it?
 
Another thought is the kind of lifejacket worn.  Some offer more bouyancy than others, although I recognize that any Ljacket is going to be tough to keep a cat afloat if the water is areated and the boil keeps pushing back into the trough. 
 
Again, glad you are ok, and none the worse for wear.  Remember, if it doesn't kill you then it makes you stronger.  Sorry that's gotta be the worst cliche ever, but couldn't help it ....
 
 
 


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Posted By: tradguy2
Date Posted: 01 Feb 2011 at 9:49am
Originally posted by Scott_H

The self-image of being held with my head just below the surface straining to get up is going to stay with me for a while.
That image t is still seared into my mind.  It was pretty horrific.   


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... preparing for a river beating!     


Posted By: Scott_H
Date Posted: 01 Feb 2011 at 10:37am

Thanks Chip and Mike.

I was wearing a drysuit.  I don't know what would have happened with drypants, but the current was strong enough to almost pull one of my booties off and gag me a bit with my helmet strap.  I retired my drypants some time ago and a few stories have scared me from using them in the future.
 
In somewhat remarkable timing, the night before I had switched out my 2-3 year old Astral PFD (300) for a newly purchased Astral Greenjacket.  I had bought the new PFD because I wanted as much bouyancy as possible and figured my old vest had probably lost some.


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“The problem with people who have no vices is that generally you can be pretty sure they're going to have some pretty annoying virtues.”


Posted By: franzhorner
Date Posted: 01 Feb 2011 at 10:48am
I'm glad you are OK and have taken a positive reflection on your situation.  I've had a couple of gnarly near misses in my time boating and I know it can really occupy your thoughts for a while after...

My first gnarly swim was in guide training in 2001 when I swam from the left side of the entrance of Boulder Drop, back into the bubble pool, over the Needle (maybe Ned's), and then didn't get a breath until after Flypaper.  This was at about 5500cfs.  I believe I was under Flypaper as I remember rocks being above me and below me while circulating around in some dark water.  I had time to try multiple things down there including doing the cannonball and nothing got me out of the total beat down.  I gave up and let my entire body go limp and thought that was it.  It was kind of like passing out.  When I came to I was being shot out of the water almost to my waist just below Flypaper where I swam to a rock and started puking water.  I thought I was still in the rapid and had to be yelled at to get out of the river.  The first thing another trainer said was "get the f#4k out of the river",  "stand up!", and then "did you hit your head"?   In that swim I was worked up against the big rock in the entrance while really deep, took another beat down on the ledge going back to the bubble pool and then didn't get a breath for a long long time.  My face and entire body was badly bruised and it took a lot of fortitude to not portage Boulder Drop during the next days training.  Lucky for everyone else they were able to get out on river left almost immediately.....

I think that swim was really bad because I had dry pants on with a fleece top and splash jacket and a low float PFD.  Those pants turned into anchors and the PFD was about useless.

It took me years to get over that swim.  I used to get so nervous at Boulder Drop that I would portage.  I was tentative about running anything tougher than 3+ and used to be so nervous I would psych myself out on easy drops and end up going around every ledge and hole and missing all the fun.  Once my skills got better I very slowly started to get my game on.  Beings that this swim took place early in my career I progressed slowly in the sport....

Another beat down I took was in the last ledge of Godzilla on Yellowjacket Creek at way huge water.  I was swimming in there hanging onto my boat and paddle when another IK came in on top of me.  Hanging onto an inflatable in a hole will just keep you in the hole.  I remember consciously letting go of the boat and then trying to swim out of the backwash and I kept getting sucked back in over and over again.  Then I remembered that I needed to go deep so when I came up in the back wash I swam upstream, caught the water coming over the lip, did the cannonball and ended up coming out about 30 feet downstream.  You know you went deep when your ears pop!  it took my buddy a long time to come out too and he also had to let go of his boat to do it.....

I think keeping calm and knowing you can't fight under water currents is the most important thing when swimming in violent water.  The river has you sometimes and the river will let you go if you are going to make it out.

Cool like Fonzi, Eye of the Tiger!


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MORE RAIN PLEASE


Posted By: jP
Date Posted: 01 Feb 2011 at 11:40am
Hey Scott- just logged on and read your account- This is an AWESOME thread, and thanks to each an every one of those who responded... No bullsh*t here.
 
(maybe I shouldn't give up on Professor Paddle afterall)
 
I gotta say its the holes that scare me more than any other danger out there. As a kid I got recirculated in many holes. My paddling career has largely been about continually confronting this fear as a result. Ironicly, it is the main reason I am not a playboater despite the virtues of cultivating such skills and techniques. (so please, everyone-spare me the lecture about why I should playboat-it ain't gona happen at this point). I've found my own way of dealing with them, mainly by avoidance or choosing a precise line through them.
 
I've been somewhat ruled by my fears this winter- maybe its the high water and cold tempertures, but I think in my case it's something not related to boating at all, irrational as that sounds. Still, I get out and erode away at it a paddle stroke at a time.
 
Anyway, Scott, the main thing I want to say is that I'm glad you are ok and are taking control of your experience. You're a good dude to have out there on the water.


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Posted By: jP
Date Posted: 01 Feb 2011 at 11:53am
Originally posted by JayB

-The second is that group dynamics matter. Most of us are pretty good about keeping tabs on others in our party, maintaining spacing that allows for visual contact and some kind of communication, and regrouping when appropriate. Mark, Scott, and I just kind of do this automatically when we're together - and because of that Mark and I were able to get to Scott just a few seconds after he resurfaced.
 
Now, Jay- your message here is Spot -On, but forgive me when I say that I disagree with one thing:
 
"Most of us are pretty good about keeping tabs on others in our party, maintaining spacing that allows for visual contact and some kind of communication, and regrouping when appropriate"
 
This I disagree with. I think most people are actually very poor in this regard. That said, it leaves room for improvement and maybe this thread is a reminder that there is virtue in practicing what you rightfully just preached.
 
Having expressed that negative indictment of the paddling community, it has always been that way. Pick up Charlie Walbridges's book and he will express those same sentiments. On the other hand, I have to say how pleasantly surprised to find out how wrong I was about one of my paddling buddies recently, when I got stuck in a pourover in Gettin Busy @ 3.6' or 3.7' or whatever it was that day- when I rodeoed out and was paddling downstream again- he had gotten out of his boat in anticipation of my swim, and was on standby on the bank. Thanks, Bro! I should have more faith in you by now.


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Posted By: JayB
Date Posted: 01 Feb 2011 at 12:52pm
Hey JP:

Have to agree with you there on the second point. I was just adding a couple of quick thoughts and didn't phrase that one as precisely as I should have.

What I should have said is something like "Most of us are pretty good about keeping tabs on others in our party...when we're part of a tight crew with solid bonds of friendship and experience that we've woven together on the river, and we've consciously made that a part of the way we operate on the water."

The less the group you're in resembles the above, the less likely it is that everyone will be good about...maintaining spacing that allows for visual contact and some kind of communication, and regrouping when appropriate.

I think we're all guilty of slacking on this one from time to time and we collectively get away with it because it's the sort of thing that doesn't matter, until it does.

I'm not sure what the best way to counter this problem is other than trying to exercise good judgment about what you run and with whom, and just trying to be the kind of partner/paddler that you'd like others to be.


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-Jay


Posted By: JayB
Date Posted: 01 Feb 2011 at 1:21pm
Just a couple more thoughts while I'm at it:

-It's impossible to piece together a picture that accurately accounts for all of the factors that enabled Scott to come out of that awful, awful swim while still conscious.

While I think there just about always valuable lessons we can learn from an incident like this, at the end of the day it's hard to credit anything other than bad luck keeping Scott down for so long, and good luck that he flushed out when he did. I'm sure there were people out there who employed all of the hydraulic-exiting techniques we've been talking about perfectly and drowned, and there are many, many more people who did none of them and lived.

Having said that - I'm convinced that it's possible to improve the odds of surviving by employing all of the techniques outlined here, and while I've tried to imprint them into my mind since I've been paddling - I haven't made it a point to try to practice any of them (other than some involuntary practice at rodeoing out of holes, and getting better about not pre-maturely pulling).

-Scott was conscious when he emerged and within a few seconds he was able to assist in our efforts to get him to shore, despite not being able to breathe. If there's any factor that stand out in my mind above all others - it's that Scott's conditioning (particularly cardio) may have been what allowed him to remain conscious by the time he emerged.

The fact that he was conscious allowed him to get his face out of the water (he resurfaced face down from what I remember), and it made it a many times easier to get him to shore. Had he been unconscious, I'm not sure we'd have been able to get him to shore before he was swept through the rest of the rapid.

-Had neither Mark or I been there, right on the spot when he resurfaced, the odds are high that he may not have been able to make it to shore on his own before being swept through the second half of the rapid.



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-Jay



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