Originally posted by peteg
I said waterfall height doesn't necessarily make it a given rating. Just because a waterfall is 18' doesn't mean it's "pushing Class 5". This simply isn't the case. The big falls on Eagle Cr., Clackamas River is a great example. 15-18' falls with little to no maneuvering to line up, large aerated pool at the bottom, bit of a slope so difficult to land too flat. Not Class 1 or 2 but solid 3.
My point, again, is that you can't separate the rating from what the actual rapid is or the nature of the run with general statements. Well, I guess you can but it's either going to get you into trouble or really limit the rivers you choose to run. Your choice. I just think people try to put way too much emphasis on the rating and getting it perfect rather than acknowledging that it can't possibly be perfect.
Sorry for the hi-jack but it's always an interesting discussion although it sounds the same as it has for years and years.
pete
I think you took my post a bit out of context... so I did the same. That's way more interesting than finding common ground.
I agree though height of a drop alone is no way to evaluate a rapid. However all other things being equal, height of a drop is definitely a factor. My point was once you're getting close to 20 feet of drop, that's a lot of drop and in most cases if you have enough water dropping that far there going to be some kind of violentness (not a word, but I think it fits) going on that's going to make it at least class 4 and it won't take a whole lot more.... sticky hole, undercut, pin potential, guard rock... etc. to make it class 5.
And I do know the falls on Eagle Creek you're talking about. It was one of the first drops actually considered a falls that I ran back in the 90s. And you're right it's a pretty simple point a plop affair, however I'd still consider it a 4. (in my old soggy sneakers it was called a 5) Even on a relatively easy drop like that there's a very real possibility of landing badly and getting hurt...above and beyond the risk you would find in your average class 3 rapid. I know on the trips I made there that all the class 3 boaters were carrying thier boats around, while the class 4 boaters were firing it off with reckless abandon.
I like your input about getting yourself educated about the real nature of a run rather than getting caught up in numbers. There's huge differences even within the class ratings... Class 4 can be ledges on the Cooper or Fall in the Wall or it can be massive whitewater on the Lochsa... it can be big punishing powerful drops with long pools in between and it can be long continuous rapids that you can lose your boat in if you swim. And of course certain boats are better than others on different streams and levels. That's why one of my goals as a member of the Rio Banditos is to get as much accurate and helpful information into the river descriptions as possible, and encourage people to contribute to and learn from them. Knowing a river's difficulty rating should be only a first step in deciding whether to run a river.
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Luckily he popped up just before he ran outta breath. 